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#quoteboost

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Jupiter RowlandAre you referring to my mentions being @<a href="https://mspsocial.net/@bright_helpings" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Erik :heart_agender:</a> and @<a href="https://beige.party/@roknrol" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Roknrol</a> rather than what you're used to, namely <a href="https://mspsocial.net/@bright_helpings" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">@⁠bright_helpings</a> and <a href="https://beige.party/@roknrol" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">@⁠roknrol</a>? Using the long name rather than the short name and keeping the @ outside the link rather than making it part of the link? Likewise, the # being outside the hashtag link rather than being part of it?<br><br>This is because <strong>I'm not on Mastodon. <u>The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. It has never been.</u></strong> So this is not a toot.<br><br>No, really. This is what I post from: <a href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/channel/jupiter_rowland" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/channel/jupiter_rowland</a>, <a href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/profile/jupiter_rowland" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/profile/jupiter_rowland</a>. I ask you: Does this look like Mastodon? Have you ever seen Mastodon look like this?<br><br>Where I am, this style of mentions and hashtags is hard-coded. And it has been since long before Mastodon was even an idea.<br><br>I'm on something named <strong>Hubzilla. Hubzilla is not a Mastodon instance. Hubzilla is not a Mastodon fork either.</strong> Hubzilla has got absolutely nothing to do with Mastodon at all.<br><br>It is its very own project, fully independent from Mastodon (<a href="https://hubzilla.org" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://hubzilla.org</a>, <a href="https://framagit.org/hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://framagit.org/hubzilla</a>, <a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://joinfediverse.wiki/Hubzilla</a>).<br><br>Hubzilla has not intruded into "the Mastodon Fediverse" either. The Fediverse is older than Mastodon. And <strong>Hubzilla was there before Mastodon.</strong><br><br><strong>Hubzilla was launched by @<a class="" href="https://fediversity.site/channel/mikedev" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mike Macgirvin ?️</a> in March, 2015, <em>eight months before Mastodon</em>,</strong> by renaming and redesigning his own Red Matrix from 2012, <em>almost four years before Mastodon</em>. And the Red Matrix was a fork of a fork of his own <strong>Friendica, which was launched on July 2nd, 2010, 15 years ago, <em>five and a half years before Mastodon</em>.</strong> (<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/Friendica</a>, <a href="https://friendi.ca" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://friendi.ca</a>, <a href="https://github.com/friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://github.com/friendica</a>, <a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://joinfediverse.wiki/Friendica</a>)<br><br><strong>Friendica was there before Mastodon, too.</strong><br><br>Here's the official Friendica/Hubzilla timeline on Hubzilla's official website to show you that I'm not making anything up: <a href="https://hubzilla.org/page/info/timeline" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://hubzilla.org/page/info/timeline</a>. Scroll all the way down and notice all the features that you may right now know for a fact that the Fediverse doesn't have, but that Friendica has introduced to the Fediverse 15 years ago, five and a half years before Mastodon was launched.<br><br><strong>Again, Mastodon has never been its own network. The Fediverse has never been only Mastodon.</strong> When Mastodon was launched in January, 2016, it immediately federated with<br><ul><li>GNU social, the successor to @<a href="https://cosocial.ca/@evan" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Evan Prodromou</a>'s StatusNet from 2008 (the actual start of the Fediverse, <em>eight years older than Mastodon</em>)</li><li>@<a class="" href="https://fediversity.site/channel/mikedev" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mike Macgirvin ?️</a>'s Friendica, now maintained by @<a href="https://social.diekershoff.de/profile/tobias" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Tobias</a> and @<a href="https://pirati.ca/profile/heluecht" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Michael 🇺🇦</a></li><li>@<a class="" href="https://fediversity.site/channel/mikedev" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mike Macgirvin ?️</a>'s Hubzilla</li></ul><br>Friendica has been formatting mentions and hashtags the way I just did for 15 years now. When Mastodon was launched, Friendica has been formatting them that way for five and a half years already, and Hubzilla has done so for ten months. It is hard-coded there. It is not a user option.<br><br>That's because <strong>not everything in the Fediverse is a Twitter clone or Twitter alternative. [b]Friendica was designed as a Facebook alternative with full-blown long-form blogging capability.</strong> And Hubzilla adds even more stuff to this. <strong>This is why Friendica and Hubzilla don't mimic Twitter.</strong><br><br>Another shocking fact: As you can clearly see here, <strong>Friendica and Hubzilla don't have Mastodon's 500-character limit. Friendica's character limit is 200,000. Hubzilla's character limit is 16,777,215</strong>, the maximum length of the database field. And it's deeply engrained in their culture, which is many years older than Mastodon's culture, to not worry about the length of a post exceeding 500 characters.<br><br>One more shocking fact: <strong>Friendica has had quote-posts since its very beginning. So has Hubzilla. Both have always been able to quote-post any public Mastodon toot, and they will forever remain able to quote-post any public Mastodon toot. And Mastodon will never be able to do anything against it.</strong> <em>(By the way: In 15 years of Friendica, nobody has ever used quote-posts for dogpiling or harassment purposes. Neither Friendica nor Hubzilla is Twitter.)</em><br><br>You find this disturbing? You think none of this should exist in the Fediverse, even though all this has been in the Fediverse for longer than Mastodon?<br><br>Then go ahead and block all instances of Friendica and Hubzilla as well as all instances of Mike's later creations, (streams) (<a href="https://codeberg.org/streams/streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://codeberg.org/streams/streams</a>) from 2021 and Forte (<a href="https://codeberg.org/fortified/forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://codeberg.org/fortified/forte</a>) from 2024.<br><ul><li><a href="https://friendica.fediverse.observer/list" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://friendica.fediverse.observer/list</a></li><li><a href="https://fedidb.com/software/friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://fedidb.com/software/friendica</a></li><li><a href="https://rumbly.net/communities?project=friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://rumbly.net/communities?project=friendica</a></li><li><a href="https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=friendica</a></li><li><a href="https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=friendica</a></li><li><a href="https://hubzilla.fediverse.observer/list" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://hubzilla.fediverse.observer/list</a></li><li><a href="https://fedidb.com/software/hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://fedidb.com/software/hubzilla</a></li><li><a href="https://rumbly.net/communities?project=hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://rumbly.net/communities?project=hubzilla</a></li><li><a href="https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=hubzilla</a></li><li><a href="https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=hubzilla</a></li><li><a href="https://rumbly.net/communities?type=streams_repository" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://rumbly.net/communities?type=streams_repository</a></li><li><a href="https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?type=streams_repository" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?type=streams_repository</a></li><li><a href="https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?type=streams_repository" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?type=streams_repository</a></li><li><a href="https://rumbly.net/communities?project=forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://rumbly.net/communities?project=forte</a></li><li><a href="https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://nomad.fedi-verse.hu/communities?project=forte</a></li><li><a href="https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://streams.elsmussols.net/communities?project=forte</a></li></ul><br>Or you could go ask @<a href="https://pleroma.envs.net/users/Seirdy" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Seirdy / DM me the word "bread"</a> and @<a href="https://sunny.garden/@gardenfence" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Garden Fence Blocklist</a> as well as @<a href="https://h-i.social/@are0h" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mad Villain</a> of @<a href="https://h-i.social/@thebadspace" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">The Bad Space</a> to add every last instance on any of these lists to their blocklists for being "rampantly and unabashedly ableist and xenophobic by design" due to not being and acting and working like Mastodon and just as rampantly and unabashedly refusing to fully adopt and adapt to the Mastodon-centric "Fediverse culture" as defined by fresh Twitter refugees on Mastodon in mid-2022 as well as refusing to abandon their own culture which is disturbingly incompatible with Mastodon's. Essentially try and have four entire Fediverse server applications Fediblocked once and for all because they're so disturbing from a "Fediverse equals Mastodon" point of view.<br><br>Or you could go to Mastodon's GitHub repository (<a href="https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon</a>), submit a feature request for defederating Mastodon from everything that isn't Mastodon <em>by design</em> and then go lobbying for support for your feature request.<br><br>As for why I have so many hashtags below my comments, here is what they mean. Many of them are meant to trigger filters, including such that automatically hide posts behind content warning buttons, a feature that Mastodon has had since October, 2022, that Friendica has had since July, 2010, and that Hubzilla has had since March, 2015.<br><br><ul><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> = This post is over 500 characters long. Create a filter for either or both of these hashtags if you don't want to see my or anyone else's long posts.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> = CW: long post (over 500 characters long). Create a filter for either or both of these hashtags if you don't want to see my or anyone else's long posts.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> = This post talks about the Fediverse. Create a filter for either or both of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone talk about the Fediverse.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> = CW: Fediverse meta. Or: CW: Fediverse meta, Fediverse-beyond-Mastodon meta. Or: CW: Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta. Create a filter for either or both of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone talk about the Fediverse.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=NotOnlyMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">NotOnlyMastodon</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseIsNotMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseIsNotMastodon</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonIsNotTheFediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonIsNotTheFediverse</a>: This post talks about the Fediverse not only being Mastodon. Create a filter for either or multiple or all of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about the Fediverse being more than Mastodon. Otherwise, click or tap any of these hashtags to read more about it in your Fediverse app.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a>: This post talks about the Facebook alternative in the Fediverse named Friendica. Create a filter for it if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about Friendica. Otherwise, click or tap it to read more about it in your Fediverse app. It is also meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a>: This post talks about the Swiss army knif of the Fediverse named Hubzilla. Create a filter for it if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about Hubzilla. Otherwise, click or tap it to read more about it in your Fediverse app. It is also meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a>: This post talks about the Facebook alternative in the Fediverse commonly referred to as (streams). Create a filter for either or both of them if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about Friendica. Otherwise, click or tap either of them to read more about it in your Fediverse app. It is also meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forte</a>: This post talks about the Facebook alternative in the Fediverse named Forte. Create a filter for it if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about Forte. Otherwise, click or tap it to read more about it in your Fediverse app. It is also meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> = This post talks about alt-text and/or contains an image with alt-text. It is primarily meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> = This post talks about alt-text. Create a filter for this hashtag if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about alt-text.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> = CW: alt-text meta. Create a filter for this hashtag if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about alt-text.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> = This post talks about image descriptions and/or contains an image with an image description. It is primarily meant for post discovery.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> = This post talks about image descriptions. Create a filter for either of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about image descriptions.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a> = CW: image description meta. Create a filter for this hashtag if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about image descriptions.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hashtag</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hashtags" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hashtags</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=HashtagMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">HashtagMeta</a> = This post talks about hashtags. Create a filter for either of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about hashtags.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWHashtagMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWHashtagMeta</a> = CW: hashtag meta. Create a filter for this hashtag if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about hashtags.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> = This post is talking about character limits. It is primarily meant for post discovery. But if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about character limits, create a filter for any of these hashtags.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> = This post talks about quote-posts and/or contains a quote-post. If this disturbs you, create a filter for any of these hashtags.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> = This post talks about quote-posts. Create a filter for either of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about quote-posts.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePostDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePostDebate</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTootDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTootDebate</a> = This post talks about quote-posts. Create a filter for either of these hashtags if you don't want to see me or anyone else talk about quote-posts.</li><li>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediblockMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediblockMeta</a> = This post is talking about fediblocks. It is primarily meant for post discovery.</li></ul><br>Lastly: <strong>Having all hashtags in one line at the very end of a post that only contains hashtags is the preferred way in the Fediverse.</strong> For one, hashtags in their own line at the end of the post irritate screen reader users much less than hashtags in the middle of the text. <strong>It's actually hashtags in the middle of the text that are ableist.</strong> Besides, <strong>Mastodon is explicitly designed to have a separate hashtag line at the end of the post.</strong>
Jupiter Rowland@<a class="" href="https://loves.tech/channel/scott" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Scott M. Stolz</a> Don't mix up quotes and quote-posts. They're something <em>very</em> different, not only in technology, but also in use-case and especially in cultural implications.<br><br><blockquote>Whereas on platforms with threaded conversations, quotes are usually used in comments within a thread, and on many platforms, such comments could be removed by the thread owner.</blockquote><br>This is a quote. Like in a bulletin-board forum. This is actually only used in comments. For Mastodon users, it's basically unimaginable that this ever happens in social media. Twitter has never had this, so most Mastodon users don't even know the very concept of this. Thus, it is not what they're upset about.<br><br>What Mastodon users are so upset about are quote-posts. What they refer to as "quote-posts" or "quote-toots" is what we call "shares" or "shared posts", what Twitter/X calls "quote-tweets", and what is used on Twitter/X for harassment and dogpiling purposes, namely this:<br><br> <a href="https://loves.tech/channel/scott?f=&amp;zid=TheNurseIsIn%40med-mastodon.com" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank"></a><span><a href="https://loves.tech/channel/scott?f=&amp;zid=TheNurseIsIn%40med-mastodon.com" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Scott M. Stolz</a> schrieb den folgenden <a href="https://loves.tech/item/e10ec895-9fc2-4c2e-a3be-9c51ba9179da?f=&amp;zid=TheNurseIsIn%40med-mastodon.com" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Beitrag</a> <span class="">Tue, 10 Jun 2025 08:54:18 +0200</span></span> It should be noted that Twitter-style platforms use quote posts in an entirely different way than platforms with threaded conversations. <br><br>With Mastodon, someone can quote you, criticize you, and then people dogpile on. Since it is not part of a thread, and is its own top level post, nothing can be done about it.<br><br>Whereas on platforms with threaded conversations, quotes are usually used in comments within a thread, and on many platforms, such comments could be removed by the thread owner. Yes, they can create new top level post quoting someone, but that seems to be used less on threaded conversation platforms than on Twitter style platforms.<br><br>This creates a different culture surrounding quoting people, since one has potential consequences and one does not. <br><br>Plus, I think there is also a cultural difference between people who want to broadcast their thoughts versus people who want to join conversations. People who want to participate in conversations are typically less hostile since they get banned or blocked pretty quickly. People who broadcast their posts just want as many followers to see it as possible and tend to block anyone that disagrees with them. It is a different mindset. <br><br>That is why Mastodon has to implement quote controls, but thread conversation platforms do not. <br><br>You should see that it's something completely different. This <em>never</em> happens within the same thread. It wouldn't make sense to quote-post/quote-tweet/share a post in a comment on that same post.<br><br>This is what Mastodon users what to have control over. This is what they want to prevent. Entirely. They would want a switch that makes Hubzilla hide the Share button under a post of theirs if they knew that a) Hubzilla exists, and b) Hubzilla can share posts/quote-post.<br><br>This is what @<a class="" href="https://fediversity.site/channel/mikedev" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mike Macgirvin ?️</a> keeps preaching over and over and over that literally the only possible way to keep this from happening is by not posting in public. For this is what neither Hubzilla nor Mike's own (streams) and Forte have a permission setting for because even their highly advanced and fine-grained permissions systems have no way of implementing actually water-tight quote-post control. So what chance does Mastodon have with its total lack of a permission system and no understanding of Hubzilla's, (streams)', Forte's or even only Friendica's permission system?<br><br>Mastodon doesn't have either implemented, neither quotes nor shares/quote-posts, at least not beyond displaying quotes properly formatted (it is working on displaying quote-posts properly formatted now). Hubzilla has inherited both from Friendica which has had both for 15 years.<br><br>CC: @<a href="https://mastodon.bayern/@matteo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Matteo (Mastodon)</a><br><br>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forte</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Quote" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Quote</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Quotes" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Quotes</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePostDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePostDebate</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTootDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTootDebate</a>
L'égrégore André ꕭꕬ<p>One of the (many) reasons I'm looking forward to the quote boost function is it'll allow me to boost important, but maybe triggering stuff and add a CW.</p><p><a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Mastodon" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#<span>Mastodon</span></a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/QuoteBoost" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#<span>QuoteBoost</span></a></p>
Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mastodon.bayern/@matteo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Matteo (Mastodon)</a> Nur daß ich nirgendwo ein Zitat sehe (und ich sehe den kompletten Thread auf einem Haufen) und auch keinen Quote-Post (hier auf Hubzilla sind das zwei total verschiedene Sachen, und Hubzilla hat schon immer beides unterstützt; das gilt für die ganze Software-Familie).<br><br>Wahrscheinlich wenden Phanpy und Tusky irgendeinen Trick an, der Mastodons Einschränkungen umgeht, der aber mit etablierten Standards völlig inkompatibel ist. Wahrscheinlich wissen die Entwickler weder von Phanpy noch von Tusky, daß es Quote-Posts im Fediverse schon gibt, geschweige denn, wie die gemacht werden. Also hat sich da jemand etwas völlig Neues ausgedacht, das dann nur von ein, zwei Mastodon-Apps unterstützt wird, aber von keiner einzigen Serversoftware, die Quote-Posts eingebaut hat.<br><br>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LangerPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LangerPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLangerPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLangerPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTr%C3%B6t" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTröt</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTr%C3%B6ts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTröts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePostDebatte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePostDebatte</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTr%C3%B6tDebatte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTrötDebatte</a>
Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mastodon.bayern/@matteo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Matteo (Mastodon)</a> <blockquote>Anyone can copy text from anywhere, start a new thread in the Fediverse, copy it in there, mark it as a quote or not, and make fun of the author.</blockquote><br>And if that fails, they'll resort to what they've always been doing: screenshots. Not even (streams) and Forte with their advanced permissions systems can keep people from taking screenshots. (Then again, they don't have a quote-post permission setting either because such a thing wouldn't work across the Fediverse anyway.)<br><br>In the meantime, Friendica has had quote-posts for a decade and a half, and they've always been used sincerely, believe it or not. Same on Friendica's various descendants.<br><br><blockquote>If the author is not fairly mentioned in the thread, he may never find out about it and be able to defend himselve.</blockquote><br>If you're quote-posted from Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte, you're automatically notified as if you've been mentioned. I'm not sure about those server apps that have implemented Misskey's way of quote-posting, though.<br><br>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Misskey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkeys" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkeys</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forte</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePostDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePostDebate</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTootDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTootDebate</a>
Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mastodon.social/@reiver" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">@reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman:</a> <blockquote>I didn't know Hubzilla had been doing quote-posts for so long — very cool.</blockquote><br>It has indirectly inherited them from Friendica, and Friendica was born with quote-posts as early as 2010.<br><br>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a>
Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mastodon.social/@reiver" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">@reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman:</a> Does this work for you as intended? Just checking. (Quote-post from Hubzilla using 15-year-old technology)<br><br> <a href="https://mastodon.social/@reiver" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank"></a><span><a href="https://mastodon.social/@reiver" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">@reiver ⊼ (Charles) :batman:</a> schrieb den folgenden <a href="https://mastodon.social/@reiver/114632378858369015" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Beitrag</a> <span class="">Thu, 05 Jun 2025 21:21:28 +0200</span></span> <br>OMF!G, I just saw a "native" quote-post on mastodon.social !!!<br><br>...<br><br>I am seeing them from Bluesky accounts bridged to the Fediverse.<br><br>I just did a test myself.<br><br>RE: <a href="https://fed.brid.gy/r/https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:scewmn2pl3oz36mxme2b6czz/post/3lquzwwupf22d" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://fed.brid.gy/r/https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:scewmn2pl3oz36mxme2b6czz/post/3lquzwwupf22d</a><br><br><a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#QuotePost</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#QuoteTweet</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Fediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#Fediverse</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/FediUX" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#FediUX</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/FediverseUX" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#FediverseUX</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/DeSo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#DeSo</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/FeSo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#FeSo</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/LoSo" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#LoSo</a> <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#Mastodon</a> <br><br>#<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a>
Replied in thread
@Chris Alemany🇺🇦🇨🇦🇪🇸 The Mastodon devs are talking as if either the Fediverse is only Mastodon, or the Fediverse as a whole doesn't have quote-posts.

Neither of this is true. The Fediverse has had quote-posts since July 2nd, 2010 when Mistpark (now known as Friendica) was launched. Mastodon toots have been quote-post-able since Mastodon itself was launched, for when Mastodon was launched, it immediately federated with at least two Fediverse server applications that have quote-posts, namely Friendica and Hubzilla, a fork of a fork of Friendica by Friendica's own creator.

Nowadays, at least Pleroma, Akkoma, all other Pleroma forks, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp-JS, Iceshrimp.NET, CherryPick, Sharkey, all other Misskey forks, Mitra, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can quote-post Mastodon toots with no problem.

And Mastodon won't be able to stop them. No, seriously, it won't. Not with a non-standard, proprietary, home-brew opt-in or opt-out switch that doesn't tie into anything that the other Fediverse server apps have. And whatever switch Mastodon is working on will not tie into anything that already exists.

Let me put it this way: Hubzilla has the second-most advanced and fine-grained permissions system in the Fediverse. It goes well beyond most people's imagination. It works on three levels: for the whole channel (that's similar to a Mastodon account), for individual contacts (that's "followers" in Mastodon lingo, but Hubzilla doesn't distinguish between followers and followed), for individual content. (streams) and Forte are the only ones with an even more advanced and fine-grained permissions system.

But even they don't have a quote-post permission setting. And they have permission settings for just about everything. You want reply control in the Fediverse? Hubzilla has reply control, and (streams) and Forte have reply control on steroids. But what they don't have is a quote-posting permission because that's next to impossible to control across the Fediverse even with the most advanced permissions system.

As @Mike Macgirvin ?️ (professional software developer for almost half a century, designer of two Fediverse protocols, creator of Friendica and Hubzilla, inventor of nomadic identity, creator and maintainer of (streams) and Forte) says: The only way to make your posts un-quote-post-able is by not posting in public and not allowing everyone in the Fediverse full access to your posts. Set your "Who can quote" however you want, I'll always be able to quote-post all your public posts with no problem and with no resistance.

So what chance does Mastodon have then? Mastodon which doesn't even know what permissions are? Developed by Eugen Rochko who actually has a history of head-butting with Mike Macgirvin, and who would never take any step towards anything that Mike has ever developed?

I'm commenting from Hubzilla right now, and I'm also on (streams). And I can tell you: If you make any of your posts "un-quote-post-able", this still won't make my Share buttons on Hubzilla and (streams) disappear.

CC: @Stefan Bohacek @FinchHaven sfba

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Calckey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Iceshrimp.NET #CherryPick #Sharkey #Mitra #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate
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Replied in thread
@David Mitchell :CApride:
Mostly, just imagine you’re telling your friend over the phone about image you’re looking at and what they would need to know.


Let's just say I'm a bit critical about that because, in my opinion, it doesn't work in the Fediverse.

Jupiter Rowland schrieb den folgenden Beitrag Fri, 04 Oct 2024 23:30:02 +0200

You can't describe images in Fediverse posts like over the phone

Allegedly, a "good" advice for image descriptions is always to describe images like you'd describe them to someone on a landline phone.

Sorry, but that's non-sense. At least for anything that goes significantly beyond a real-life cat photo.

If you describe an image through a phone, you describe it to one person. Usually a person whom you know, so you've at least got a rough idea on what they need described. Even more importantly, you can ask that person what they want to know about the image if you don't know. And you get a reply.

If you describe an image for a public Fediverse post, you describe it to millions of Fediverse users and billions of Web users. You can't know what they all want, nor can you generalise what they all want. And you can't even ask one of them what they need described before or while describing, much less all of them. In fact, you can't ask at all. And yet, you have to cater to everyone's needs the same and throw no-one under a bus.

If I see a realistic chance that someone might be interested in some detail in one of my images, I will describe it. It won't be in the shorter description in the alt-text; instead, it will be in the long description which I've always put directly into the post so far, but whose placement I'm currently reconsidering. If something is unfamiliar enough to enough people that it requires an explanation, I will explain it in the long description.

Right now, only meme posts are an exception. They don't need as much of a visual description as long as I stick to the template, and a poll has revealed that people do prefer externally linked third-party explanations over my own ones blowing the character count of the post out of proportion. This is the one time that I can safely assume that I actually know what most people want.

@accessibility group @a11y group

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #Inclusion #A11y #Accessibility

CC: @Monstreline @Claire (sometimes Carla) @qurly(not curly)joe

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #QuotePost #QuoteTweet #QuoteToot #QuoteBoost
@PaulaToThePeople
Mastodon decided against quote posts so far, so Hubzilla and (streams) should not allow quoting Mastodon posts.

I mean, I could propose to Mike, Mario and Harald to automatically remove the Share button under any and all posts and comments from Mastodon, just to see their reactions.

But as a matter of fact, Pleroma and Akkoma can quote-post Mastodon toots just the same. The same goes for Misskey and its over 50 forks, including but not limited to JavaScript-based Iceshrimp which won't get any new features, Iceshrimp.NET which isn't officially released yet, Sharkey, CherryPick and Catodon. And Friendica can quote-post Mastodon toots, too.

Several dozen Fediverse server projects can quote-post Mastodon toots. They all would have to change. Or they all would have had to change the moment that it was decided that Mastodon lacks quote-posts to protect its users rather than to stay simple.

And where are you reading that Mastodon will reinvent the wheel? To me it reads like they are working on Fediverse-wide interoperability for these features.

That has been Mastodon's track record since its very inception. I won't believe that anything has changed about this until Mastodon actually implements technology introduced by another Fediverse server project.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate
hub.netzgemeinde.euNetzgemeinde/Hubzilla
@PaulaToThePeople It isn't just a matter of consent. Besides, for example, I do have quote-post control here on Hubzilla.

I can give permission to quote-post my posts to
  • everyone in the Fediverse
  • everyone on Hubzilla and (streams)
  • everyone on this hub
  • approved and unapproved connections
  • only approved connections
  • only those of my connections whom I explicitly give permission by contact role
  • nobody but myself

Over on (streams), I can still give that permission to
  • everyone in the Fediverse
  • all my connections
  • only myself + specific connections whom I grant that permission either by permission role or by individual connection settings

It's much more a matter of technology.

Mastodon is about to completely re-invent the wheel with a non-standard, Mastodon-only setting. This setting will only work within Mastodon simply because it probably won't even be documented anywhere, especially not before it's officially rolled out.

There simply is no way that every last instance of Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp, CherryPick, Catodon, Meisskey, Tanukey, Neko, dozens of other Misskey forks, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte etc. etc. will have that setting implemented before Mastodon rolls it out so that even the users on mastodon.social are perfectly safe from the first second on.

Besides, @Mike Macgirvin 🖥️, creator of Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte and still the only maintainer of the latter two, will never introduce proprietary Mastodon features to them. He'd rather risk (streams) and Forte becoming incompatible with Mastodon. The same goes for @Mario Vavti and @Harald Eilertsen, Hubzilla's main maintainers.

If Mastodon wants to become a perfectly safe haven against unallowed quote-posting, it has only got one choice: It must introduce something like (streams)' and Forte's user agent filter and use it to block just everything that isn't Mastodon. Like, include a hard-coded allowlist that only includes Mastodon plus what little can't quote or quote-post anyway.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Calckey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #CherryPick #Sharkey #Catodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate
hub.netzgemeinde.euNetzgemeinde/Hubzilla
Replied in thread
@PaulaToThePeople @Stefan Bohacek Keep one thing in mind:

Mastodon may not have quote-posts yet. But the Fediverse has quote-posts right now. And it has had them since before Mastodon was made.

Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp, CherryPick, Catodon, Meisskey, Tanukey, Neko, dozens of other Misskey forks, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte etc. etc., they all have quote-posts. They're all fully capable of quote-posting any Mastodon toot.

None of them has introduced quote-posts to harass Twitter refugees on Mastodon. At least Friendica and Hubzilla have had quote-posts since long before Mastodon was even made.

You will be able to choose whether your posts can be quoted at all.

At least by Mastodon users.

But since this will be Mastodon re-inventing the wheel with brand-new, proprietary, Mastodon-only technology, everything I've listed above will still be able to quote-post anyone and anything on Mastodon with zero resistance.

To quote-post myself and the guy who invented Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte:

Jupiter Rowland schrieb den folgenden Beitrag Sat, 20 Jul 2024 01:29:11 +0200 I think I've just chased someone out of the Fediverse.

That someone was afraid of Mastodon being "screwed over" by becoming quote-post-able.

I've told him the truth: Mastodon has been quote-post-able for as long as it has been around. Mastodon became quote-post-able the very moment it was launched.

That's because when Mastodon was launched, it immediately federated with Friendica which is from 2010, which had been around for almost six years at that point, and which has had quote-posts from its own inception AFAIK. Mastodon also immediately federated with Hubzilla which has had quote-posts since its own inception, since it had been forked from Friendica, and that was in 2012.

Mastodon has never been un-quote-post-able.

Right now, there are dozens of Fediverse server apps whose users can quote-post Mastodon toots with no resistance.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate
Mike Macgirvin 🖥️ schrieb den folgenden Beitrag Sat, 20 Jul 2024 03:18:39 +0200 The closest you'll ever get to making Mastodon un-quote-postable is to post privately. Not unlisted. Private. Most fediverse software will honour this today; and it doesn't require yet another "pretend permission". Like unlisted.

And Mike should know. He brought things to the Fediverse like actually working permissions. Including permissions on two levels to quote-post any content on a channel. Readily available right now at least on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte.

Also, this is what people on Friendica and its descendants have been using quote-posts for since 2010.

You will be notified when someone quotes you.

You already are when someone on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte quote-posts one of your posts.

As for Pleroma, Misskey and their forks, you aren't notified right now, and I've got my doubts that you will be after this change.

Also, "quote" and "quote-post" are two different things. Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte can do both. "Quote" is what I'm doing right here. Whether or not you're notified depends on whether or not you're mentioned.

And blocking quotes is even less possible. A quote only consists of a pair of BBcode tags plus the quoted text in-between. And on Friendica and all its descendants, you don't work with a WYSIWYG editor by default, but you have to get your hands dirty on raw markup code.

You will be able to withdraw your post from the quoted context at any time.

Again, probably not if someone on Pleroma, Misskey or one of their forks quote-posts you.

And definitely not if someone on Friendica or one of its descendants quote-posts you.

The difference is that a quote-post on Pleroma, Misskey or one of their forks is actually a reference to the original. On Friendica and its descendants, a quote-post is an automatically generated dumb copy of the original.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Calckey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #CherryPick #Sharkey #Catodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate
Replied in thread
@toolbear#🪧 From an outside-of-Mastodon point of view (I'm posting this from Hubzilla which is very, very much not like Mastodon), I can see schisms through the Fediverse happen quite easily.

For example:
  • One side: Mastodon fundamentalists who want to enforce the Mastodon culture and the Mastodon "rules" (both as established by the first wave of Twitter refugees in the mid-2010s, based solely on Mastodon 3.x and completely ignoring the rest of the Fediverse) all over the whole Fediverse. And everything that doesn't comply must be defederated.
  • The other side: Places that can do the same as Mastodon, but that aren't Mastodon, and that have their very own culture, not to mention features which are deeply engrained in their culture, but forbidden in Mastodon's culture. Pleroma and its forks. Misskey and its forks, fork-forks, fork-fork-rewrites etc. Friendica and its family tree. And so forth.

Or, although this may become obsolete:
  • One side: Those on Mastodon who don't want to have quote-posts in the Fediverse.
  • The other side: Again, just about everything that isn't Mastodon while capable of doing Mastodon things, because it all does have quote-posts right now.

A variant that's more likely to happen soon:
  • One side: Mastodon, full stop. It has introduced quote-posts. It has also introduced a quote-post opt-in or opt-out switch. This switch, however, is proprietary, non-standard and completely incompatible with the rest of the Fediverse.
    On top of this, as demanded in that one quote-post feature request, there's a new rule for all Mastodon instances: Any and all Fediverse instances which "circumvent" Mastodon's quote-post opt-in or opt-out switch to quote-post Mastodon toots must be regarded "rogue" and Fediblocked.
  • On the other side: Once again, just about everything that isn't Mastodon, but that can do what Mastodon can do. Once again, it can quote-post right now. It can also quote-post Mastodon toots right now. And it won't know that proprietary, non-standard, Mastodon-only opt-in or opt-out. So it can quote-post any and all Mastodon toots with zero resistance.

The logical result: All Mastodon instances must immediately block all instances of Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp-JS, Iceshrimp.NET, CherryPick, Sharkey, Catodon, Neko, Meisskey, Tanukey, Mitra, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte etc. etc. All instances of all of these have quote-posts. They can all quote-post Mastodon toots. And when Mastodon introduces the opt-in or opt-out switch, they won't know that switch. And what they don't know, they can't heed. So they'll still be able to quote-post any and all Mastodon toots, completely regardless (and oblivious) of opt-in or opt-out status.

This, however, is against the new rule that states that all instances that can quote-post toots that shall not be quote-posted must be blocked. Which applies to all of them. Thus, all of them, every last one of them, must be defederated.

If properly carried out, this would fully separate several dozen entire Fediverse server applications from Mastodon. The only reason why these server applications won't be fully separated is because it's a game of whack-a-mole. Mastodon can't defederate entire server applications by user agent (this is possible and actually implemented on both (streams) and Forte), so server applications have to be defederated instance by instance.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #MastodonCulture #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #FediSchism
joinfediverse.wikiHubzilla - Join the Fediverse
Replied in thread
@Stefan Bohacek
Also worth mentioning that quote boosts, which have also recently received funding, will include work on privacy and safety features around them, possibly extending to other areas of the online experience.

These "privacy and safety features" are non-sense.

They're proprietary, they're non-standard, they're Mastodon-specific. And they are expected to work only by respecting a proprietary, non-standard, Mastodon-specific quote-post permission flag which probably won't even be documented anywhere except Mastodon's server code.

The opt-out feature will only work within a 100% Mastodon bubble and even that only if no non-Mastodon user finds content from within this bubble by searching mastodon.social for hashtags.

Mastodon is selling its whole quote-post feature as a total revolution, as the very introduction of quote-posts to the Fediverse. And it will work. I've once run a poll on whether the Fediverse has quote-posts. 71% of all voters thought the Fediverse does not have quote-posts right now. And that was in my bubble which, in comparison to Mastodon in general, is fairly Fediverse-savvy and full of non-Mastodon users.

But as a matter of fact, the Fediverse does have quote-posts right now! Almost everything that can do microblogging in a way has quote-posts.

Pleroma has quote-posts.

Akkoma has quote-posts.

Misskey has quote-posts.

Firefish has quote-posts.

Iceshrimp has quote-posts.

Iceshrimp.NET has quote-posts.

Sharkey has quote-posts.

Catodon has quote-posts.

Friendica has quote-posts.

Hubzilla has quote-posts.

(streams) has quote-posts.

And so forth.

They haven't introduced quote-posts to spite Mastodon. Some of them have had quote-posts since before Mastodon even existed. Friendica, for example, was created with quote-posts available, and that was five and a half years before Mastodon was created. For as long as Mastodon has existed, Friendica could quote-post Mastodon toots. And so could Hubzilla, created ten months before Mastodon.

In fact, all of the above can quote-post any Mastodon toot right now, with no problems, with zero resistance.

Guess what'll change when Mastodon introduces quote-posts plus the opt-in switch.

Well, Mastodon will be able to quote-post. Mastodon might be able to display quote-posts from outside properly, but probably not because it's ignoring that the rest of the Fediverse can quote-post.

But the rest of the Fediverse will still be able to quote-post just about all Mastodon toots. With no problems. With zero resistance. Even with the opt-in switched to off.

Because that switch is proprietary, non-standard and Mastodon-specific. Because only Mastodon even supports it.

This switch will cause many many more Mastodon users to learn the hard way that the Fediverse is more than Mastodon. Namely by encountering a post or comment from something that does not behave like Mastodon. And many many more Mastodon users will shit bricks in sheer terror upon this revelation.

If Mastodon really wanted this switch to be 100% waterproof, it would have to implement the feature request in its entirety. That includes defederation from all Fediverse instances that don't respect the opt-in switch.

Mind you, the defederation clause and the entire feature request came from someone in the firm belief that the Fediverse is Mastodon, only Mastodon and nothing but Mastodon. Just like about every other Mastodon user out there. So it was only targetted at rogue Mastodon instances with hacked source code.

In reality, however, it would require entire non-Mastodon Fediverse projects to be Fediblocked because they can quote-post without respecting Mastodon's quote-post opt-in switch.

All instances of Pleroma, of Akkoma, of Misskey, of Firefish, of Iceshrimp including Iceshrimp.NET, of Sharkey, of Catodon, of Friendica, of Hubzilla, of (streams) and so forth would have to be Fediblocked because they can quote-post without respecting Mastodon's quote-post opt-in switch. Every last one of them.

Mastodon's quote-post feature will either cause a rift through the Fediverse if this rule is put into action or even more people to shit bricks in terror and escape to Bluesky if it isn't.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Fedisplaining #CWFedisplaining #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Forkey #Forkeys #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Iceshrimp.NET #Sharkey #Catodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse #FediblockMeta
hub.netzgemeinde.euJupiter RowlandPoll: Does the Fediverse have quote-posts right now? Please boost for a larger sample size and more diverse and unbiased votes! (Also, intentionally no CW this time.) #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFedimeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #Quote
Continued thread
I could post the entire context of this for better understanding.

But for one, this would require sharing (= Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams) lingo of quote-posting) a whole number of very long (= way over 500 characters) comments on a not exactly short post. And besides, I guess quote-posting an anti-racist activist falls under harassment and therefore racism itself. Because quote-posts are always harassment.

In fact, I'm now waiting for hub.netzgemeinde.eu to be added to Fediverse blocklists. I can already see Mastodon users try to have the hub.netzgemeinde.eu moderation sanction me, only to fail because
  • Mastodon-style reports to remote instances are probably not implemented on Hubzilla
  • no Mastodon interface tells you who the admin of hub.netzgemeinde.eu is
  • the hub website itself doesn't tell you either
  • even if they figured out who the admin is, he won't notice being mentioned by a non-contact out of the blue because this behaviour is off by default on Hubzilla
So from a Mastodon point of view and by Mastodon standards, hub.netzgemeinde.eu is not sufficiently moderated to silence such an utterly, deeply racist pig as me. And being undermoderated has always been a valid reason for a Fediverse instance to be Fediblocked.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #QuotePostDebate #QuoteTootDebate #Racist #Racism #FediblockMeta
hub.netzgemeinde.euNetzgemeinde/Hubzilla
Replied in thread
@Yohan Yuki Xieㆍ사요한・謝雪矢 I'm not even sure if Laconi.ca/StatusNet could quote, much less quote-post. It wanted to be microblogging, and it supported the Twitter API from some point on, but it didn't aim to be a Twitter clone.

As for Friendica or rather Mistpark, I'm convinced it had quote-posts already when it was first released in July, 2010. It didn't try to mimic Twitter either, though, because it was positioned as an alternative to Facebook.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoosts #QuotedShares #Laconica #Laconi.ca #StatusNet #Mistpark #Friendika #Friendica
hub.netzgemeinde.euNetzgemeinde/Hubzilla